 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion GroupsPC HardwareCPUMotherboardsVideo CardsStorageNetworkingPeripheralsBrand Name Systems Related Topics Video GamesWindowsMS Server ProductsMS OfficeMore Topics ... |
Hardware Forum / Brand Name Systems / Dell / May 2006Add hard drive to E510, can I do it?
I have always shyed away from making hardware changes myself (other than installing cards and memory). I want to add an internal hard drive to my Media Center E510 desktop. One 250G internal isn't enough. I think stores charge around $40 or more to do this. I want to do it for two reasons -- to save money, and to understand more about how to do hardware changes, which has always been a mystery to me. If I buy a hard drive, how difficult is it for someone who has never done that before to install it. I know there is a huge jumble of wires inside the computer. I think those are power leads? So, would I just need to put it in an internal open slot (I hope there is one) which would basically be screwing it in, attaching one of the power leads to the hard drive, and attaching something else (what?) from the hard drive to the main computer board? Is that it in a nutshell? Also, is it your experience that the drives come with good documentation about how to do this? Journey >Is that it in a nutshell? Also, is it your experience that the drives >come with good documentation about how to do this? > >Journey Oh, probably BIOS stuff too, and what about "master / slave" drives, controllers, that kind of thing? I guess I should have post "OT: " at the beginning of my post, I'll try to do that next time. Journey > >Is that it in a nutshell? Also, is it your experience that the drives >>come with good documentation about how to do this? [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Journey The E510 should use a SATA drive. Make sure you get the right one. With SATA, there isn't a concept of Master or Slave. Just plug it in, bring up the BIOS and change it from OFF to AUTO and reboot. > Oh, probably BIOS stuff too, and what about "master / slave" drives, > controllers, that kind of thing? > > I guess I should have post "OT: " at the beginning of my post, I'll > try to do that next time. Just open it up, you will need a spare SATA power lead, check the cable that is already plugged into your current hard drive and see if you have another spare. Follow the data lead, which will be thicker than the SATA power lead, back to the board to see if their is a spare slot next to it to use for your new drive. By experience no new hard drives don't come with good documentation, certainly if you look for the cheaper OEM drives. >Just open it up, you will need a spare SATA power lead, check the cable that >is already plugged into your current hard drive and see if you have another [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >By experience no new hard drives don't come with good documentation, >certainly if you look for the cheaper OEM drives. Great! Thanks Tom and Joe. I've heard that Seagate are good so I'm going to look for a good deal on a 250G+ SATA. Journey >>Just open it up, you will need a spare SATA power lead, check the cable >>that [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Journey The E510 looks like the same form factor that my XPS400 has. My computer has the harddrives mounted cross-wise in the bottom of the computer. If your's is the same way and the open drive space is there next to your primary drive you will need a 90 degree SATA data cable to plug into the new drive. A standard straight connector will not fit. These cables are a bit hard to come by but www.newegg.com does carry them. If there is space in your upper drive bays in the front of the computer you can mount your new drive there using a standard straight SATA cable. You'll need to open the computer to determine where you have an open drive bay. Mark Piece of cake. There is an empty space right next to the first HD. There already is a power connector available to plug into the new drive, but you'll have to buy a SATA data cable long enough to go from the MB connector to the new HD. A SATA data cable that has a right-angle connector on the HD end is preferred, but an ordinary one will fit. I bought my E510 with an 80gig drive, and I added a 100gig just to store recorded TV shows til I can burn them to DVD's. >I have always shyed away from making hardware changes myself (other > than installing cards and memory). [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Journey complete service manual for you computer http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim5150/sm/index.htm detailed instructions regarding hard disk installation http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim5150/sm/parts0.htm#wp1366406 and a western digital 300gb 3.5" sata drive for $95 delivered... but you need to also purchase a sata data cable. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822144701 >I have always shyed away from making hardware changes myself (other > than installing cards and memory). [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Journey >complete service manual for you computer >http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim5150/sm/index.htm [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >need to also purchase a sata data cable. >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822144701 Woo hoo, thank you Christopher! Journey > but you >need to also purchase a sata data cable. This is the cable I found: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16812107018 It looks like a good one :-) ? 3 foot length... Journey OK, it's on its way. I hope I got the right cable. Transfers data faster at up to 150MBps Offers compact 7-pin connector and slim design for better airflow and reduced cable clutter The drive operates at 3.0Gb/s; I'm not sure how to translate that into what kind of cable I need. This will be fun, thanks to all who responded. I'm learning a LOT on this group. Journey Then you've chosen your handle well..... ;-) Regards, Hank Arnold > I'm learning a LOT on this group. > > Journey > OK, it's on its way. I hope I got the right cable. > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Journey Actually the drive operates no where near 3Gbps, rather SATA II can potentially transfer at up to that speed. To reach such speed would require a serious RAID array (and most likely a dedicated controller card plus more drives than you have slots). An individual 7200RPM drive can barely saturate an ATA/100 connection (only for brief moments); even a 10,000RPM drive won't come close to SATA's max rate by itself. you got the right cable. if need be there is a jumper that can be installed the drive to force it to operate at the lower speed. but i don't think that will be necessary to do. other than following dell's physical installation instructions you need to go into the bios and enable the secondary sata drive. > OK, it's on its way. I hope I got the right cable. > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Journey the only thing that you can do to hurt the drive is plug it in when the system already turned on or to connect both the standard type power plug and the new style sata power plug. just use one, preferable the sata style power (along with the sata data connector). > you got the right cable. if need be there is a jumper that can be > installed the drive to force it to operate at the lower speed. but i [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >> >> Journey Three feet long?? Are you going to connect it to the computer next door? :) >> but you >>need to also purchase a sata data cable. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Journey > Three feet long?? Are you going to connect it to the computer next door? > :) newegg.com r0x0rs the b0x0rs, even from a yard away.:) Don't think he'll need quite that much length (perhaps 12" to 18" at most), but that's why pull ties were invented. (g) Stew >Three feet long?? Are you going to connect it to the computer next door? >:) Heh that's funny. I hadn't had any sleep the night before, and I was so spacey... I can't believe I bought one that is 3 feet long lol. Journey Actually that's probably the right length to get. Inside the case, if you were to connect a cable in a straight line between the SATA connector on the top rear of the MB to the HD down in the lower left of the case, a shorter cable might work. But if instead you route the SATA data cable via the same path the original one uses, it goes straight up from the HD to the top of the MB then turns right and continues to the rear of the MB. Because of going up then straight back, you might find a 24" isn't long enough. been there, done that. Either way, too long is much better than too short. Missed it by thaaaaaaaaaaat much. >>Three feet long?? Are you going to connect it to the computer next door? >>:) [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Journey > Actually that's probably the right length to get. > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Missed it by thaaaaaaaaaaat much. I don't disagree with that logic. All of the newer Dell BTX chassis require significant SATA cable routing; over, under, around shroud plastics and tabbed into place. He's a lot better off going long than short. Stew that cable is very long, but it should be fine. you will be able to put the excess cable someplace. belkin is good quality, thought this particular cable is somewhat gimicky with its coating that glows under ultra violet light (that some people actually put inside their computer cases along with a window on the side of the case so you can see inside). this 20", $2.49 cable would have also been fine... but both have $4.99 shipping. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16812105911 it is not worth changing your order over. >> but you >>need to also purchase a sata data cable. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Journey Adding a hard drive, in general, isn't a big problem. You should have gotten a guide with the system (maybe on CD) or you can get one off of the Dell site. Having said that, $40 ain't bad if you've never opened a computer of worked on one. If you *do* have it done at a store, I'd strongly recommend you have a full backup of the system before you bring it in. Regards, Hank Arnold > I have always shyed away from making hardware changes myself (other > than installing cards and memory). [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Journey > I want to add an internal hard drive to my Media Center E510 desktop. > One 250G internal isn't enough. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > power leads to the hard drive, and attaching something else (what?) > from the hard drive to the main computer board? Check the drive temperatures: DiskCheckup http://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm >> I want to add an internal hard drive to my Media Center E510 desktop. >> One 250G internal isn't enough. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > DiskCheckup > http://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm Can't imagine it would be that high. It's a well ventelated case. So, yes, it is that simple. Remember, it is a SATA drive. Tom >> Check the drive temperatures: > > Can't imagine it would be that high. It's a well ventelated case. I haven't seen an E510/E5150 in person, but from pictures one can tell it has a vertically stacked hard drive cage which is rotated for easy access. Many such arrangements provide less than ideal airflow over the drives. To illustrate, down this page is a picture of a vertical/rotated cage: http://www.silentpcreview.com/article60-page1.html The large oval openings allow air to move over both the tops and bottoms of each drive, keeping them cool. I can't find a good pic of a E510/E5150 hard drive cage, but it looks as though it might be the same as that in the 5000: http://www.tecchannel.de/_misc/img/detail1000.cfm?pk=342558&fk=402544&id=IM_5CF8 BDB6-DEFB-681E-D2DB0CE838836B8A which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >>> Check the drive temperatures: >> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >http://www.tecchannel.de/_misc/img/detail1000.cfm?pk=342558&fk=402544&id=IM_5CF8 BDB6-DEFB-681E-D2DB0CE838836B8A Exactly like that, and that's why I asked. >which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? I have an E510 that has had two HD installed running 24/7 since October when I bought it, with absolutley no problems whatsoever. Here's a link to the E510's service manual. BTW, the photo of the 5000 does indeed look just like the E510 in that area. >>> Check the drive temperatures: >> [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the > drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >I have an E510 that has had two HD installed running 24/7 since October when >I bought it, with absolutley no problems whatsoever. Check the drive temperatures? DiskCheckup http://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm >Here's a link to the E510's service manual. > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? Ambient temp outside the case 31.4 C HD 1 Maxtor 80gig 31.0 C HD 2 Maxtor 100gig 31.0 C System is currently idle, running Windows MCE I'd have to wait till it's activally recording a TV show before I can record temps under load. >>I have an E510 that has had two HD installed running 24/7 since October >>when [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] >>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >Ambient temp outside the case 31.4 C >HD 1 Maxtor 80gig 31.0 C >HD 2 Maxtor 100gig 31.0 C 31.4 C = 88.5 F - Don't you have cooling? Drives are cooler than ambient???!!! The same temperature for top and bottom bay???!!! My measurements with one dirive: Ambient - 27.8 C (82 F) Drive at top bay - 40 C Drive at bottom bay - 42 C Drive at bottom bay with no drive at top is 2 degrees warmer, thus made me wonder how warm a second drive at bottom bay would be when top is not only blocked, but occupied with warm object. Based on my measurements, I say that your numbers are hard to believe. >System is currently idle, running Windows MCE I'd have to wait till it's >activally recording a TV show before I can record temps under load. [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the case. No, the house has no airconditioning and its about 88 F outdoors. And yes, if there is airflow past the drives, it would very easily be a bit lower than outside temp. Later tonight when it's activilay recording a TV show, I'll see if I can remember to check the drive temps again. >>Ambient temp outside the case 31.4 C >>HD 1 Maxtor 80gig 31.0 C [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] >>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the >case. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >And yes, if there is airflow past the drives, it would very easily be a bit >lower than outside temp. Or, your Dell must have a built-in air conditioner. >Later tonight when it's activilay recording a TV show, I'll see if I can >remember to check the drive temps again. The measurents are not going to change any. >>>Ambient temp outside the case 31.4 C >>>HD 1 Maxtor 80gig 31.0 C [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] >>>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >>Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the >>case. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Or, your Dell must have a built-in air conditioner. Yeah, that's it.... The Dell's air conditioned....... drops the temp of the HD's a whole .4 C. >>Later tonight when it's activilay recording a TV show, I'll see if I can >>remember to check the drive temps again. > > The measurents are not going to change any. Only one way to find out. Keep in mind the systems sits idle most of the time. It's only current function is to record various TV shows. It's just a glorified DVR. My main work is done on a completely different system. >>>>Ambient temp outside the case 31.4 C >>>>HD 1 Maxtor 80gig 31.0 C [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] >>>>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV show.... Desktop thermometer atop the case reads 92.1 F (house has no air conditioning) Arrording to DiskCheckup Top Drive Maxtor 80gig 48 C Bottom Drive Maxtor 100gig 53 C >>>Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the >>>case. [quoted text clipped - 87 lines] >>>>>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV >show.... [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Top Drive Maxtor 80gig 48 C >Bottom Drive Maxtor 100gig 53 C These are more realistic numbers. Guess that either drive by itself runs at 40 C. They say don't run hard disk over 50 C -- over 60 C is considered critical. If I were you, I would seriously consider replacing the two drives with one large capcity drive. And that's exactly what I am going to do rather than adding another drive. Thanks for the data. That's exactly what I needed to make a decision. >>>>Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the >>>>case. [quoted text clipped - 87 lines] >>>>>>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>>>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? >>OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV >>show.... [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > exactly what I am going to do rather than adding another drive. > Thanks for the data. That's exactly what I needed to make a decision. You're welcome. Both drives are rated to run at up to 60C but I admit on hot days like today, I'm getting close to the upper comfort zone. Right now the capacity is fine. The system boots to the 80gig and the recorded shows are stored on the 100gig. Right now I can record roughly 30 shows before it starts deleting the old shows automatically, and If I let it go that long then it's a pain to sit down and transfer them to DVD's. The system was bought with the 80, and the 100 was added later . At the time I couldn't afford anything larger than the 100gig. I'm not quite sure how much I would save in terms of operating temps if I went to a larger single drive. Would it be enough to offset the cost of buying another drive? Maybe, maybe not.... I'll have to ponder that a while.. >>>>>Ambient temp is measured by a desktop thermometer sitting on top of the >>>>>case. [quoted text clipped - 92 lines] >>>>>>>>>> which would appear to provide essentially no airflow across the >>>>>>>>>> drives. Anyone seen an E510/E5150 and can comment? > >>OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV > >>show.... [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > I'll have to ponder that a while.. If you run only one drive, most likely it will run at around 40 C. If you have any Western Digital serial number (no matter out of warranty), check out their Customer Appreciation program. 250GB SATA is supposedly $65. >>OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV >>show.... [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > These are more realistic numbers. [] Even those look low to me, but then it is quite possible that said activity wasn't putting a major load on the target HD much less both of them. > >>OK, temps recorded while the system is currently actively recording a TV > >>show.... [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Even those look low to me, but then it is quite possible that said activity > wasn't putting a major load on the target HD much less both of them. All I wanted to know was whether the temperature went over 50 C, and how much more is inconsequential. I meant 'realistic' in that context. BTW, thanks for the pic of the drive bay. As the saying "one picture is worth ten thousand words" says, I am sure it warded off unbelievers. >I have an E510 that has had two HD installed running 24/7 since October > when I bought it, with absolutley no problems whatsoever. [] BTW, the > photo of the 5000 does indeed look just like the E510 in that area. Whether or not a given hard drive arrangement could have an impact on drive longevity is kind of a complicated question. It would depend on a bunch of factors including ambient temp, box cleanliness, number and type of hard drives used, the types of bearings used in the drives, drive load(s), yadda. I don't know enough to make the calls so I try to avoid making any definitive statements on that subject. However, I still tend to categorize HD arrangements as "good" through "bad". You can look at one and make an educated guess as to whether the drives will run on the cooler or hotter side. Based on the pics I've seen so far, I'd say that the E510/E5150 type HD mounting arrangement and general system setup would push the HDs to the hot side. Only testing would tell though. Speaking of which, have you monitored your HD temp sensors? I came to realize that they aren't always the best indicator of when temps exceed what they should in the places that they shouldn't, but they are convenient and give some sense. I'd be interested to know your ambient, idle temps for both drives, and then the max temps you can achieve (when running HD burn in or benchmarking utils for awhile). If I had such a unit I would pick a time when ambient is near the upper end of what it would normally be and then at least compare the max temps under max sustained load to the max operating temps listed in the drive specs. A second HD will drop right in. The power connector is already positioned to plug right into the new drive. However, you WILL have to purchase a SATA data cable to go from the new hard drive to the MB. When you look to buy a SATA data cable, you need to make sure the end of the cable that will plug into the HD has a right-angle connector on it. otherwise the side panel of the case won't fit back on. >> I want to add an internal hard drive to my Media Center E510 desktop. >> One 250G internal isn't enough. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > DiskCheckup > http://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2010 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.