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Hardware Forum / Brand Name Systems / Dell / June 2007Interesting Customer Service Experience
I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. I was transferred to one area first, I believe it was Customer Service. They had to transfer me to another area which is for warranty sales. I received terrible service from the warranty sales area. In addition to overall bluntness and a poor attitude, he gave me incorrect information: - The first date he gave me for the extension date was 2005. I had to ask him where 2005 came from, because I bought the laptop in 2007, and a warranty extension would have a date into the future. - Then he said it would cost over $560 to extend my warranty. I said that it didn't seem right and asked the end date. He said it was 2012. - Then he asked what level of service I wanted -- next day at site, or some other ones. I asked him if there is a cheaper one in which I could mail it in. He said no. I asked if they ever had that. He said yes. I asked when that stopped being offered. He said last week. I asked for his supervisor, who he said is unavailable. There is more to it. I chalked it up to a very small "Dell Hell" experience (this is nothing compared to what I have had in the past). I was going to follow up next week and file a complaint against this person, who didn't want to identify himself, but I did get a name and direct extension. OK HERE IS THE AMAZING PART The Dell customer service person who transferred me to warranty sales had stayed on the line and heard the entire conversation! He called me back while I was on the phone and left a message apologizing for the poor service and that he and his manager will follow up on it. In his message he even said something about him probably being terminated. A bad experience was turned into a good experience. I still don't know what the warranty extension will cost -- I'll do that on Monday. > The Dell customer service person who transferred me to warranty sales > had stayed on the line and heard the entire conversation! LOL Perhaps they really are starting to put the customer first again - sure, you'll always end up getting the odd crap employee, but if they do this for a while to weed out the really bad ones :-p Perhaps if you give it a couple of days they'll call back with a follow-up, and hopefully someone who can actually deal with your request :-) >> The Dell customer service person who transferred me to warranty sales >> had stayed on the line and heard the entire conversation! [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >follow-up, and hopefully someone who can actually deal with your >request :-) I sent an e-mail in to the person who stayed on the line so I am sure that there will be a followup. In the past I was under the impression that warranty sales was outside of Dell but based on this it doesn't seem like it. I think almost everyone has had experiences in which the "support" person on the other end of the line was totally rude and / or not competant. It felt good to have Dell actually call me back and leave a message saying that they heard it and could validate that it actually was as bad as I thought it was. When did they ever start? Al >> The Dell customer service person who transferred me to warranty sales >> had stayed on the line and heard the entire conversation! [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > follow-up, and hopefully someone who can actually deal with your > request :-) There are exceptions, but the general rule is that extended warranties must be bought either with the unit or shortly thereafter (Toshiba allows 30 days). In most cases, once you get "down the road", you can't buy an extended warranty (this is to prevent fraud ... people trying to buy an extended warranty AFTER a failure has occurred). In general, I don't recommend extended warranties for laptops unless they include "accidental damage coverage". > I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like > it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > I still don't know what the warranty extension will cost -- I'll do > that on Monday. >There are exceptions, but the general rule is that extended warranties >must be bought either with the unit or shortly thereafter (Toshiba [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >In general, I don't recommend extended warranties for laptops unless >they include "accidental damage coverage". Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in savings toward the next one. I'm willing to take the risk. >Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in >savings toward the next one. I'm willing to take the risk. I am just wondering -- do you know what a laptop repair costs? I don't know. Say that the display is loose and flops back and forth, but you don't have the technical savvy to fix it and want to send it in. I have no idea what it would cost. Once I had to have a motherboard replaced. I guess at that point, if it's outside of warranty, the laptop is a total loss. Pricing and quality for laptop repairs are all over the map. If the warranty has expired, out-of-warranty service provided by the vendor (or its surrogate service provider) is normally ridiculously high in price, to encourage you to buy a replacement computer. Post warranty service from a Dell-certified dealer can also be high priced. Post warranty service from an independent service provider is generally least expensive, but the quality can range from superb to the worst. But then, even a Dell affiliate can bungle a job using poorly trained personnel. Cost of parts is also a factor. New parts cost more and are generally harder to find for older models. Used but servicable parts may be just right. The part that needs to be replaced is important. LCD screens are pretty costly. So are motherboards. Plastic to replace cracked parts is generally not expensive. Replacement hinges for an LCD screen are inexpensive, but the job to replace them is tedious, so expensive. Hard drives are commodity items, so they are relatively cheap. Data recovery from an almost failed hard drive is expensive, and generally not covered by any manufacturer's warranty. CD/DVD drives often have custom bezels which drive up the price. miniPCI wifi cards are inexpensive. Resoldering a broken power connector back onto a motherboard is advertised in a lot of places for around $100. This is something I will not do, as I have neither tools nor expertise to solder a motherboard properly. That's sort of what I have learned from being a non-certified service person willing to tackle any brand of notebook as long as some sort of sketchy info is available for disassembly... Ben Myers >>Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >>won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >Once I had to have a motherboard replaced. I guess at that point, if >it's outside of warranty, the laptop is a total loss. >Pricing and quality for laptop repairs are all over the map. > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] >willing to tackle any brand of notebook as long as some sort of sketchy info is >available for disassembly... Ben Myers Thank you Ben -- another keeper for my archives (stored in Info Select -- www.miclog.com and therefore instantly retrievable). I may just keep my 2 year warranty and not extend a 3rd because it's too much trouble. (by the way, the video card with the loud fan will get to you eventually, I just haven't gotten around to sending it yet). >>Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >>won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >Once I had to have a motherboard replaced. I guess at that point, if >it's outside of warranty, the laptop is a total loss. No Journey I don't nor care because I won't repair it (pay for it). I've seen the cost of extended warrantees in the past and didn't think it was worth it to me. I consider the laptop disposable if it comes to that. >>>Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >>>won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >it was worth it to me. I consider the laptop disposable if it comes >to that. Yes -- extended warranties are expensive indeed. With Dell, at least they give a refund on the warranty. I did that with the XPS 410 desktop (not sure if I mentioned that already). I actually got more of a refund ($153) than what I paid for it at the outlet store ($100), but I wasn't about to get all honest about it and create a Dell Hell experience waiting on the phone for hours while they try to determine how to refund me $53 less. >>>>Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >>>>won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >experience waiting on the phone for hours while they try to determine >how to refund me $53 less. I understand. It would probably cost you $53.00 in aggrevation or stress anyway trying <g>. Replacing a screen or a motherboard out of warranty will cost as much as a new computer in most cases. It's usually not an economically feasible repair. RnR's point is valid; it depends on your risk profile and tolerance. But some situations, especially those with a LOT of travel and high-risk environments (college students who use a laptop as their only computer definitely qualify) have a higher than normal risk profile. >> Personally I don't recommend them in "most" cases. For myself, I >> won't buy them and consider the money spent on them to be put in [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Once I had to have a motherboard replaced. I guess at that point, if > it's outside of warranty, the laptop is a total loss. >In general, I don't recommend extended warranties for laptops unless >they include "accidental damage coverage". Right -- I get the complete care coverage whenever I get an extended warranty for a laptop. I will find out if they allow the purchase of an extended warranty after the fact. I have over 600 days left on this warranty so fraud isn't likely and maybe they take that into account in some way. >I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like > it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > I still don't know what the warranty extension will cost -- I'll do > that on Monday. Dell gets slammed, and sometimes very rightly so, for poor customer service. But, if you really want a truly awful experience, just order a camera from one of those companies in New York, I think you all know which one I mean, and you will have memories to last a life time. These guys all, to the man, sound like they are auditioning for a part on The Sopranos. To say they were not professional is a gross understatement. Here is a brief excerpt from one conversation I had with these people: Them: Yeah! Dis is Steven. (I can hear children screaming in the background, a television blasting away to provide ambience) Me: Ummm . . . is this xxxxxxxxxx Camera? Them: Shu-ah! Wat do youse want? (More kids screaming their heads off, apparently trying to get the attention of Steven) Me: This is xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx and my order number ---(I'm abruptly cut off by Steven) Them: HO, HO, HO dere, uh Mr. xxxxxxxxx, dose numbers don't mean nuttin to me. What do youse want? (The kids are now drowned out by the television, it's volume maxed out and distorting) Me: You didn't include the extra memory card, batteries, case, strap and instructions that were shown as included on your website. I'm just calling to get those. Them: (Riotous laughter ensues) Hey, buddy! We don't include dat stuff wid dose cameras! Youse gots to buy dose seperate, ya know? Me: Steven, it is clearly indicated that those all do come with the camera. I'm looking at your website right now, and it says all these are shipped with the camera, in the retail packaging. (There is a long silence, or at least Steven isn't talking, the television, apparently tuned to a New York news station is in the process of blowing all the speakers out) Them: Hey, dere ain't nuttin I can do about dat. Call back on Wednesday, da owner otta be here by den. I gotta go. Steven then hung up. So, you see, Customer Service is different all over. And dats da name a dat tune. >Dell gets slammed, and sometimes very rightly so, for poor customer service. >But, if you really want a truly awful experience, just order a camera from >one of those companies in New York, I think you all know which one I mean, >and you will have memories to last a life time. Case in point, camera supplier from New York. If anyone wants a reality check horror story, this is a must read: http://www.epinions.com/pr-Online_Stores_Services-WAWA_Digital They went by many different names, and even put up fake opinion rating sites pointing to their "business". This was *my* reality check, and fortunately I cancelled my credit card in time after doing some post-purchase research. >>Dell gets slammed, and sometimes very rightly so, for poor customer service. >>But, if you really want a truly awful experience, just order a camera from [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >This was *my* reality check, and fortunately I cancelled my credit >card in time after doing some post-purchase research. I didn't read the link but have heard of some NY horror stories too concerning cameras but there are 1 or 2 legit / good ones there such as B&H that comes to mind. I bought from B&H years ago and they were straight up and I would have no problem dealing with them again. I feel sorry for them tho; they keep sending me these huge catalogs (real nice I might add) of their camera and camera related gear and I'm not in the market for cameras. I hate to see them waste their postage on me. > I didn't read the link but have heard of some NY horror stories too > concerning cameras but there are 1 or 2 legit / good ones there such > asB&Hthat comes to mind. I bought fromB&Hyears ago and they were > straight up and I would have no problem dealing with them again. Thank you. Henry Posner B&H Photo-Video, Inc. > -----Original Message----- > From: henryp [mailto:henryp@bhphotovideo.com] [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Henry Posner > B&H Photo-Video, Inc. Henry, Interesting to see you pop up here. I too endorse B&H (and love the catalog). Ordered from you for years and see you all over the internet. You're a great presence for B&H I'm just curious, though. I can't imagine you spend a lot of time on the Dell group. Do you have software that scans newsgroups to ensure that you see any references to B&H? Would make sense if you did. Tom >> -----Original Message----- >> From: henryp [mailto:henryp@bhphotovideo.com] [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > >Tom It's called TRADE SECRETS <g>. I don't recall right now but I know there is software to harvest email addresses so I see no reason why they can't harvest particular words also. > > -----Original Message----- > Henry, > Interesting to see you pop up here. I too endorseB&H(and love the > catalog). Ordered from you for years and see you all over the internet. > You're a great presence forB&H Thanks. > I'm just curious, though. I can't imagine you spend a lot of time on > the Dell group. Do you have software that scans newsgroups to ensure > that you see any references toB&H? Would make sense if you did. I use Google's "Alerts" widget. Easy as pie. Henry Posner B&H Photo-Video, Inc. >> I didn't read the link but have heard of some NY horror stories too >> concerning cameras but there are 1 or 2 legit / good ones there such [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Henry Posner >B&H Photo-Video, Inc. You're more than welcome. Funny but I don't remember exactly what I purchased now but I do remember I was very satisfied with your service. I hope I can purchase from you again. I enjoy your catalogs but I feel a bit guilty getting them. Hopefully I've helped pay for them a little by recommending B&H for cameras, etc.. <g>. >Case in point, camera supplier from New York. Some "great" looking storefront operations http://donwiss.com/pictures/BrooklynStores/ Best Regards, Bob Johnson >> Case in point, camera supplier from New York. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Best Regards, > Bob Johnson My fav is http://donwiss.com/pictures/BrooklynStores/0119.jpg Lots of those places (the NY/NJ mail order camera and electronics places) are every bit as bad as you indicated, but not all of them. This is a case where some research on the vendor before making the purchase can save you a lot of grief. >> I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like >> it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 79 lines] > > And dats da name a dat tune. on my 600m it was 175 for an extra year >I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like > it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > I still don't know what the warranty extension will cost -- I'll do > that on Monday. >I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like > it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > I still don't know what the warranty extension will cost -- I'll do > that on Monday. And your point is ???? >>I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like >> it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 46 lines] > >And your point is ???? If you read Journey's post, it will answer your question. >>>I called to extend my laptop warranty from 2 to 3 years because I like >>> it a lot and plan on keeping it at least that long. [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > If you read Journey's post, it will answer your question. I did read it. Just not sure who gives a sh.t > -----Original Message----- > From: Woody Dawson [mailto:woodrowDDx@msn.com] > > > If you read Journey's post, it will answer your question. > > I did read it. Just not sure who gives a sh.t The regulars here loved reading it. We like to keep a pulse on Dell. That's how we help. Oh, and we love ANYTHING that Journey posts :) We're a big FAMILY. >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Woody Dawson [mailto:woodrowDDx@msn.com] [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >We're a big FAMILY. Yes, a very large family, and Tom's a big part of it too :-) >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Woody Dawson [mailto:woodrowDDx@msn.com] [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Yes, a very large family, and Tom's a big part of it too :-) Journey, I don't mind the family growing but I guess we're getting the less desireable ones dropping by here now and hope they don't become a part of the family until they learn to behave better. You know what I mean (email me if you want as well as the regulars here; others need not bother since I'll just mark it spam). >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Woody Dawson [mailto:woodrowDDx@msn.com] [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > mean (email me if you want as well as the regulars here; others need > not bother since I'll just mark it spam). All families have less-than-desirables. Take my Uncle Jim. Please!  SignatureNotan >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Woody Dawson [mailto:woodrowDDx@msn.com] [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > >Please! Notan, no thank you. I already have one teenager that, at times, is less than desireable or should I say, tests my patience to the limit. > -----Original Message----- > From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] > >All families have less-than-desirables. > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Notan, no thank you. I already have one teenager that, at times, is > less than desireable or should I say, tests my patience to the limit. Just one? Geez, I have three of those. Wanna trade? >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Just one? Geez, I have three of those. Wanna trade? Forgive me for going OT to the rest of the group: No thank you Tom. I'd like to keep whatever sanity I have left intact. Take last nite for example... my 2nd daughter loses her house key and says it's not a big deal. When asked when she lost it, she can't remember. I tried to help but as I questioned her, her response is "no big deal" or "whatever" (seems to be a favorite word of hers). It annoys me because I didn't bring them up to be irresponsible or disrespectful. And right now I'm having to put up with a boyfriend (???) of this daughter who I'm not crazy about sleeping in my house this weekend (long story and I'll spare the details). Oh well enough of my problems. I know mine are small in comparison to others. Seriously, I don't understand why the teenagers are in some ways so immature, sometimes disrespectful and don't seem to appreciate what parents do for them. Perhaps we do too much and that actually does more harm than good???? Honestly sometimes I'm at wits end. My wife gets upset with me when I say that I can't wait for them to move out permanently tho in truth the first daughter is for the most part okay. > -----Original Message----- > From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] > >Just one? Geez, I have three of those. Wanna trade? > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > out permanently tho in truth the first daughter is for the most part > okay. Believe me I get it. They can be rude and incredibly disrespectful and 10 minutes later expect you to drive them to the mall. But hey, I love them. I just don't always like them. >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >Believe me I get it. They can be rude and incredibly disrespectful and >10 minutes later expect you to drive them to the mall. You're right !! My wife sometimes blames the TV in part for some of their behavior because they seem to mimic it. Seems like when I'm too strict, my wife gets upset with me and if I'm not strict enough, I have to deal with more disrespect.... a NO win situation for me. > -----Original Message----- > From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > strict, my wife gets upset with me and if I'm not strict enough, I > have to deal with more disrespect.... a NO win situation for me. Believe me, I get it. It's a no-win. I'm doing a better job of learning to pick my battles, especially now that I don't have backup :) >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Believe me, I get it. It's a no-win. I'm doing a better job of > learning to pick my battles, especially now that I don't have backup :) I feel fortunate to not have teenaged girls. I have the opportunity to go to a local high school with some frequency to re-affirm how out of touch I am with........today. You're both better men than I'll ever be. >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 53 lines] > >You're both better men than I'll ever be. Speaking for myself, I don't know about that but thank you anyway. I believe most parents have good intentions but it doesn't always turn out the way intended :( . >I feel fortunate to not have teenaged girls. I have the opportunity to go to >a local high school with some frequency to re-affirm how out of touch I am >with........today. > >You're both better men than I'll ever be. Some good books that may shed some insights into the emotional lives of boys and girls: Reviving Ophelia: Saving the Selves of Adolescent Girls http://tinyurl.com/3xdp4l Raising Cain: Protecting the Emotional Life of Boys http://tinyurl.com/3dmeb3 One more good book, for men with depression and the women who love them: I Don't Want to Talk About It: Overcoming the Secret Legacy of Male Depression http://tinyurl.com/2mm24e Kids may be a little more disrespectful today than in previous years because of the effects of mass media. But let's face it, teen years are a time for a great deal of physical, mental and emotional development and high time for kids to begin to assert the independence of adulthood. They still need limits and they really do want boundaries. Don't give up, although it sometimes seems like the easy way out... Ben Myers >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >strict, my wife gets upset with me and if I'm not strict enough, I >have to deal with more disrespect.... a NO win situation for me. Point taken. My mantra (silent) is that they don't have to like me. It's my job to help them grow up into the kind of adult that will someday recognize the value of their boundaries during their teen years. I have, however, told them that I'm keeping a list of everything they want to do at fourteen and think should be just fine. I've promised to share that list with their children when they turn fourteen and let them explain why THEIR children shouldn't be allowed to do those things. Fill in the blank: Piercings, tattoos, spending the night at boys houses, stay out all night. Tom > -----Original Message----- > From: Ben Myers [mailto:ben_myers_spam_me_not@charter.net] [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > >strict, my wife gets upset with me and if I'm not strict enough, I > >have to deal with more disrespect.... a NO win situation for me. I never had the luck to raise girls. My children are both young men now. They avoided tatoos and piercings, and avoided unwanted fatherhood so far but not the activities that cause it. I've seen enough of teen girls in recent years to realize that they can pose enormous challenges to parents, in part because they mature earlier physically. Hang tough with them. They will appreciate it in the long run if they end up college-educated without babies dragging them down at an early age and without any addictions or debilitating STDs. After all that, they might even have the introspection to thank you. As a good friend of mine one said about her teen son and daughter, but a number of years later, they can be horrendous as teens, but go into remission when they become adults... Ben Myers >Point taken. My mantra (silent) is that they don't have to like me. >It's my job to help them grow up into the kind of adult that will [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Tom >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > But hey, I love them. I just don't always like them. I remember the same exact words, coming from my parents' mouths. "The more things change, the more they stay the same." SignatureNotan >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > >"The more things change, the more they stay the same." The words from my mother's mouth was "I hope you have childen just like you." Mike >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > The words from my mother's mouth was "I hope you have childen just > like you." I heard that one, too. Up until the point when I knew better, I thought it was a *good* wish! <g> SignatureNotan Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. The writer James Thurber said he never did anything worthwhile in life until he started raising Scotties. SignatureRon Hardin rhhardin@mindspring.com On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk. >Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >one and a half. I don't get it. >The writer James Thurber said he never did anything worthwhile in >life until he started raising Scotties. Really? Doesn't sound like a very interesting life! >>Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>one and a half. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Really? Doesn't sound like a very interesting life! Sorry, I just re-read my post and it sounds rude. I just didn't understand the age 1 and 1/2 thing because I didn't think that happened until the teens. I also am a cat person. Dogs seem like too much work. I teach my cats to fetch so I get the best of both worlds :-) > Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age > one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. > > The writer James Thurber said he never did anything worthwhile in > life until he started raising Scotties. And that's only because Thurber never owned a Boston: http://tinyurl.com/ysu3vv >> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > And that's only because Thurber never owned a Boston: > http://tinyurl.com/ysu3vv How 'bout an Entlebucher: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=6g0ndzm SignatureNotan >>> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=6g0ndzm Better picture: http://i11.tinypic.com/6g0ndzm.jpg SignatureNotan >>>> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>>> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > http://i11.tinypic.com/6g0ndzm.jpg Honestly had never heard of them before. Looks and sounds (from the descriptions I read) like a fine animal and companion. Unfortunately, we can only keep a smaller dog and be fair to it where we're located, and we're without a pup for the forseeable future after losing our 12-year friend last year. Looks like a very strong and noble beast indeed. Stew This thread has gone to the dogs! ... Ben >>>>> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>>>> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > >Stew >>>> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>>> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >http://i11.tinypic.com/6g0ndzm.jpg Wow, that's a beautiful dog! >>>>> Get a dog. Children start planning their escape starting about age >>>>> one and a half. Dogs like you more the longer you're together. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Wow, that's a beautiful dog! Thanks! To you and Stew - We spotted a picture of the breed in a Simon & Schuster dog book, looked into them, and thought it sounded like the perfect breed for us. Here's another: http://i9.tinypic.com/4ytwh1s.jpg SignatureNotan > On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk. If only that was true. :-) - henry Actually, the accurate way to say it is that "On the internet, nobody knows who the jerk is." ... Ben Myers >> On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk. > >If only that was true. :-) > > - henry >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RnR [mailto:rnrtexas@gmail.com] [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > >But hey, I love them. I just don't always like them. I posted links in another thread, but wanted to mention it here too that there are two good books about the emotional lives and development of girls and boys. For girls, Reviving Ophelia For boys, Raising Cain The books and reviews can of course be found on Amazon. |
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